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timing belt change?


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#1 eurotrotter

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Posted 19 December 2007 - 09:47 PM

hey guys
how often should a timing belt be change in a ph2 1.9td?
the previous owner of my car claims it was only every done once @ 84 k miles on mine, and it currently has 119k miles.

can someone please advice me on this
thanks
ed

#2 mike

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Posted 19 December 2007 - 09:58 PM

if i was you i would change it for piece of mind. but normally every 72,000 or every 4 years

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#3 eurotrotter

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Posted 19 December 2007 - 10:03 PM

thanks for the reply, is there much dismantling involved in fitting a t belt to a 306, is it easily accessible, how much time are we talkin for a mechanic to do it like?

#4 welshpug

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Posted 19 December 2007 - 10:08 PM

book time IIRC on a 306 is 3.5 hours, which IIRC took me 4, but that did include a cup of tea and biccies laugh.gif

there isn't a lot to come off, but a lot to remember, get yourself a Haynes manual and an engine locking/timing tool kit and you cant go far wrong.

I would advise anyone to halve the manufacturers intervals, and change the belt at least every 36k (miles) so its overdue at the moment.

always do the whole lot, i.e belt tensioner idles AND water pump, the extra few Euro's are nothing compared to a dead engine wink.gif

#5 mike

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Posted 19 December 2007 - 10:10 PM

not to bad to do,if you know what your doing. in a garage think you get a couple of hours to do.but can be done in about 1hour ish

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#6 welshpug

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Posted 19 December 2007 - 10:11 PM

PMSL mike, go on then......

#7 Martin

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Posted 19 December 2007 - 10:15 PM

Barely do it in an hour with the engine out of the car lol!

#8 mike

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Posted 19 December 2007 - 10:20 PM

ok maybe a bit more than a 1hour tongue.gif . when i did mine thats was changed in just over 2 hour..just the belt not the tensiner or water pump

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#9 welshpug

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Posted 20 December 2007 - 11:59 PM

blink.gif why??? your engine is gonna die....

#10 Rob_Furious

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Posted 21 December 2007 - 01:52 AM

wouldnt let it go much further on a 40k belt. with ya giving it some beans an what not the belts dont last as long so do get them changed. even if it means the garage does it, but if u dont an it breaks u will regret it lol, coz it will be exspensive. an we will laugh coz u didnt change it... laugh.gif
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#11 pezzum

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Posted 24 December 2007 - 12:12 AM

with the engine out it can be done in an hour easy with the engine in its a different story and a lot trickyer say about 3-4 no longer than that at all
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#12 Stu

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Posted 24 December 2007 - 12:25 AM

Ive always found it takes longest to get the covers off... smile.gif

Not a bad job to do, as peeps have said on a 100k+ engine id do the belt pump and tensioners as a matter of course, especially if you plan on keeping the car mate.
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#13 Stey

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Posted 24 December 2007 - 01:01 AM

Cam Timing Belt for a XU7JP 1.8 SOHC







I changed my cambelt just so I could have the first thread in this topic

As the title says, it was an XU7JP, but the same principles and some parts should be the same for most XU applications. It's not overly technically difficult, but it's a bit of a pain working with so little room and I s'pose the consequences of buggering it are expensive. No responsibility accepted for damage or injury resulting from using this guide I've tried to remember everything as best I can, but could've made a mistake or two.

I used Quinton Hazell parts from BNT and oil seals from Repco.

Parts:
Timing Belt QH 94187 $47.10 ($91.13 genuine Peugeot)
Tensioner QH QTT100 $50.07 ($141.75)
Water Pump QH QCP2891 $84.08 ($259.88)
Camshaft Oil Seal 36 x 50 x 7 $1.60
Crankshaft Oil Seal 42 x 62 x 7 (or 8 ) $24.99
Total: $207.84

Essential Tools:
10, 11, 13 mm 1/4" drive sockets
16, 22 mm 1/2" sockets

13 mm ring spanner
16 mm ratchet ring spanner
16 mm offset ring spanner
Torx T30 key/socket

Stubby 1/4" drive ratchet
Any 3/8" drive tool
1/2" breaker bar

Cam sprocket holding tool
8 mm square tool (commonly found in oil sump plug spanner sets)
Two short 6 mm ish diameter rods/drill bits/Allen keys etc for locking the sprockets
Big, strong, flat screwdriver to hold the flywheel/flexplate
Jack, stands, wheel brace/19 mm socket






Jack up the front right of the car, support on a stand, and remove the front right wheel. You may wish to disconnect the negative battery lead to prevent anyone inadvertently starting the car up.

Remove the plastic alternator belt stone guard in the wheel well. It's held on with 3 'Christmas tree' clips - prise them off gently with a screwdriver. Then release the coolant hose from the clips. Try not the break anything.






Showing cover removed and hose still clipped.

Gently jack up the engine under the sump with a piece of wood on top of the jack head to distribute the load until the jack's just taking some of the weight of the engine. Then remove the top engine mount. The top bracket comes off first, the buffer thing next, and then the actual round mount. The mount unscrews, but is hard to get a grip on and might be a bit rusted to the car. I got mine off by jamming a screwdriver against the outside rim and hitting the screwdriver with a hammer.








Broken] mount waiting to be unscrewed.





Peugeot's *ahem* unique two-piece engine mount design

Leave the engine bracket attached to the engine for now.



Unclip the fuel hose clip from the top cambelt cover and push it aside. I also pushed the throttle cable aside, undid a bracket holding some wiring and the nut holding the MAP sensor on the strut tower to make more room. You may smell petrol - I had a little bit weeping out at the fuel rail end when I disturbed the hoses, but I don't think it's anything to worry about

Remove the top cover - it's held on with a 10 and 13 mm bolt at the bottom corners. This is where the stubby 1/4" ratchet is worth its weight in gold. It'll take some manouvering, but will come off in the end hopefully.

Then, undo the three 16 mm bolts on the cast bracket on the engine. One is (just) reachable under the brake fluid reservoir (now you know why the manuals have cable clutches), the other is fairly easy to get at with an offset ring spanner through the gap where the engine mount was. For the last one, go up from the wheel arch.

When the bracket bolts are undone, undo the two bolts holding the middle belt cover to the bracket. Then pull the bracket out, followed by the middle belt cover.




Now, release the alternator belt from the crank pulley by sticking a 3/8" square tool into the square hole on the spring-loaded tensioner (the big thing just in front of the crank pulley) and grunting. I think you want to be trying to turn it anti-clockwise, but you'll soon find out.

With your 22 mm socket, the car in neutral and the alternator belt removed from the crank pulley, turn the crank pulley bolt clockwise until the hole in the pulley is at about 10-11 o'clock and the hole in the camshaft sprocket is at about 7 o'clock. (The cam sprocket only turns one revolution for every two crank revolutions so don't worry too much if they don't line up the first time).

Then poke a 6 mm ish dowel through the hole in the crank pulley and find the point where it goes in further and locks the pulley. Now you should be able to poke another dowel through the hole in the cam sprocket.






Cam sprocket locked (pretend belt is still there).



Remove the locking pins and undo the crank pulley bolt.

I got someone to hold a big, strong screwdriver in the gap where you can see the flywheel/flexplate teeth while I undid the bolt to stop the engine turning backwards. The Haynes manual suggests fabricating a special tool, but I don't think it's worth it unless you're changing these belts five times a day. I needed a length of pipe on a 400 mm breaker bar to get it undone. Another (dodgy?) way is jam a breaker bar between the bolt and the ground, pull the sparkplug leads off and hit the starter briefly, without the screwdriver jammed in the teeth, obviously. Don't expect the locking pin to hold it - a bit will break off the slot (I tried).








Big screwdriver jammed in teeth (sorry, not very clear)

Once it's undone a turn or two, line up the holes again, put the car in gear/park and completely undo the bolt. Remove the pulley, being careful not to lose the Woodruff key. Now you can remove the bottom cover.




If you're changing the waterpump, drain the coolant.

Loosen the tensioner bolt, swing the tensioner around a bit to release the belt tension, and remove the belt.

Remove tensioner and water pump, and scrape off any old water pump gasket/sealant residue.

If you're changing the oil seals, remove the cam and crank sprockets as applicable. Again, don't rely on the timing holes - use a proper tool to stop the cam sprocket from turning. The crank sprocket just slides off. There might be another Woodruff key to catch.

Punch or drill a small hole in the oil seals, screw in a self-tapping screw, and pull out with pliers. Try not to go deeper than 7 mm. The cam seal was a mongrel because there's no space. I ended up just bashing it with a small nail punch
and somehow levered it out.







Cam oil seal removed

Don't panic when you see an ugly gap below the cam shaft - it's meant to be there even if it looks like you've broken something.

Put rubber grease (e.g. Castrol GRRB, red pot) on the contact surfaces of the new seals and ease them in evenly. I could push them most of the way by hand and used a hard, flat surface to push them home.

Refit sprockets and cam sprocket bolt. Haynes says torque to 35 Nm. Use a cam sprocket holding tool.




Clean any oil/grease/coolant around the cambelt area and clean the covers.

Put in the new water pump and tensioner.

The QH water pump comes with a gasket that, I hope, doesn't need any other sealant. Read the instructions with the water pump. The bolts didn't look very strong so I just sort of nipped them up 'til it felt right with a 1/4" ratchet.

Do up the tensioner bolt, then back it off a bit so it's free to move around.

Being careful not to kink or fold the belt, put the belt around the crank sprocket, refit bottom cover and crank pulley. Do the bolt up, but stop before the crank starts to move.

Put a locking pin back through the hole in the crank pulley and seat the belt in the teeth. Route the belt around the waterpump, but bypass the tensioner for now. Keep the non-tensioner side taught and loop it 'round the cam sprocket. Refit the cam sprocket locking pin. It's not too hard to get it right the first time, but if the pins no longer line up with the holes, do it again until they do.

Now you should be able to pull the belt over the tensioner.






This is taking a lot longer than I expected....

Tighten up the tensioner bolt just enough so you can still turn it with the 8 mm square tool. Give it a reasonable amount of tension and get the belt centred on the cam sprocket by removing the locking pins and turning the engine over a couple of times with the crank pulley bolt while easing the belt to the centre with your hand.

Turn it over a couple more times, and check the locking holes still line up correctly.

When you're satisfied the timing's correct, tension the belt up until you can turn it through about 90 degrees with your thumb and finger at the longest belt run. Haynes says torque the bolt up to 20 Nm, but I couldn't possibly fit a torque wrench and socket in the gap, so just did it up with a ring spanner fairly tight.








Can't see much with the engine in situ

Turn it over a couple more times and recheck for good measure.




Remove and refit the crank pulley bolt with Loctite and torque to 120 Nm. You'll probably need to get your big screwdriver out again.

Put the alternator belt back around the pulley.

Refit the middle cover and bolt it back to the cast bracket thing before you bolt the cast bracket thing back to the engine. Both bits should go in from the top. Then, spend the next half hour doing up the brackets and mount. I think it's easier to put the top cover back before the bit that goes from the mount to the engine bracket. Haynes reckons 45 Nm for the nuts. Good luck getting a torque wrench near the bolts.

Put all the hoses, cables etc back where they were to start off with and re-clip the big coolant hose.

Refill and bleed the coolant.

Check for leaks around the water pump. You may want to start the car at this stage to make sure it still works.

Refit the stone guard and wheel, lower the car to the ground and bob's your uncle.

Watch the temperature gauge like a hawk and monitor coolant levels for the next few drives.







My I thank V8Pete off eurosport in New Zeland for taking time to write this biggrin.gif

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